[TrickyDick]

I just watched some of Landscapers Challenge. I have watched it now and then and am I crazy or is the stated "budget" that they are working with a fantasy? It is annoying enough that people think they can get free landscape designs from multiple designers but it is even worse that the show gives the misimpression that landscaping is cheaper than it is. People already underestimate what it costs, we've all seen the sticker shock, and the last thing we all need is a succesful TV show reinforcing that idea. What I don't get is what producers of the show gain by choosing not to reflect the reality of the process.

Or am I off base? I know there are regional differences in pricing but it doesn't seem to matter where that show takes place.

[papercutter]

One of two things must be happening: either the homeowner bumps their budget up to do the project and HGTV doesn't see the need to share that, or the installers are doing it at or near cost to get the exposure. I used to tivo every episode just to see what people were doing for presentation drawings, and that Billy Derian guy was the WORST offender. I remember him doing a complete backyard makeover with a resort-style lagoon pool with grottoes and a stone bridge for a stated budget of like $30K. Ridiculous.

[Stonehenge]

We have a few winners of the show here, so it'd be interesting to get their input. But I think the understanding is that they are trading exposure for a cheap price.

That being said, at least the budgets were in the 5 figure range. Too many of those shows show how to do a $5-10,000 project for $540. I haven't watched in awhile, but I thought I remembered budgets being around $50k.

Though I don't have time to watch (nor the desire to watch) any of those shows anymore, Groundbreakers was my favorite, because it seemed like they were really nice projects with realistic budgets for the given work. Budgets of $50-150K were common on that show.

[HRLand]

I'll watch groundbreakers occaisionally because they usually have some interesting projects. I had a good laugh during one episode where a worker is laying down a pipe to screed sand and the narrarator says "here a crew member is installing irrigation lines for the plantings".

[NCSULandscaper]

ive always wondered how much the show matches the customers budget

[Stonehenge]

Originally Posted by HRLand

"here a crew member is installing irrigation lines for the plantings".

If I had a quarter for every client that asked "Is that for drainage?"...

[LandArts]

In my case the budget was stated as $20k with $5k in reserve when what the homeowner wanted should have cost around $35-40k. My design was comprehensive and I refused to compromise quality. Bid it at $23k, would have lost about $12k installing it IF I had won. The winner bid it at $20k but he didn't meet all their needs and cut corners BIG TIME. Plywood covered with stucco for walls, stone dust "patio" near the pool where kids and dogs were sure to make a mess of things, inadequate privacy screening, rip rap "necklace" water feature. It looked great on TV.

[TrickyDick]

So is it the producers of the show that encourage that or is it simply that the various designers are just trying to create a showpiece landscape regardless of price for the publicity? I just don't think the show would lose any appeal by showing the reality of the process, budget constraints and all. I'm sure the PR gained by the winner is significant but is it really worth devaluing the whole industry?

[Stonehenge]

But consider the pressure in your own mind of the value of exposure like that. Would you be willing to eat a little here or there in order to have a national audience for your work? If I were put in that position and started thinking about all the potential work we might get if it was my work that was showcased, I'd probably shave all margins as tight as possible. I'd bet many others would, too. Especially with work being as hard to come by as it's been for most of us.

[LandArts]

I think those HGTV shows did a lot to elevate interest in our industry. How many homeowners were looking to hire a "designer" 15 years ago? I used the past tense because Landscapers' Challenge was canceled by the network two years ago and some of the other shows have been dumbed down with lower budgets and a silly DIY emphasis. Groundbreakers is a pretty good show but their projects are way bigger than most people can afford.

[agla]

I definitely agree that these shows have done way more good than harm. You might not like her personality, but Martha Stewart did a great deal for our industry before so many other garden type shows popped up.

It still is a pain in the neck when people think they will get three designers to do free designs for them. They learn pretty quickly that it does not work that way, at least in my area. I see plenty of posts on nonprofessional garden forums that indicate that getting an established landscape designer to do more than return a phone call without compensation or the right address is pretty difficult. That is reality. Design people learn very quickly that they can waste all of the hours in a week chasing time consuming dead end leads that keep them from billable work.

Then you get the people who think you'll do three totally different designs so that they can pick the one that they like best. I have only run into that once or twice. Like anything else, if you turn the process into one that forces the client into acting efficiently, everything goes much smoother and quicker.

[TrickyDick]

I don't doubt that these shows have helped increase interest in what we do. I just don't see what would be lost by having realistic budgets. They could have the client work with an independent consultant first to determine what could reasonably be expected for their budget. Maybe there's no way around each designer trying to jam as many goodies in as possible. And yes if I was on the show I would do the same thing. It just annoys me a little.

[Lanelle]

It does seem that a disclaimer notice regarding the budget and the accuracy of the portrayal of the value of the project would reduce the degree of sticker shock that homeowners get when they try to replicate those projects as seen on TV. That would reduce the outrage felt on both sides of the fence.

[billyD]

Originally Posted by papercutter

One of two things must be happening: either the homeowner bumps their budget up to do the project and HGTV doesn't see the need to share that, or the installers are doing it at or near cost to get the exposure. I used to tivo every episode just to see what people were doing for presentation drawings, and that Billy Derian guy was the WORST offender. I remember him doing a complete backyard makeover with a resort-style lagoon pool with grottoes and a stone bridge for a stated budget of like $30K. Ridiculous.

Billy Derian (Derian Quality Pools) here-

In my defense and in defense of all the other designer/builders who have worked on Landscaper's Challenge, the REAL budgets are set by the Owners after the design presentation!

For example, an Owner may have the fantasy that $30K will do a yard...they give us their dreams and we do plans. All the designers do the plans according to a site meeting with the Owners and producers of the show. Most plans will reflect the wish-list not the budget initially told to the producers!

We, as designers, do not even know the budget until we present the plans. In all 10 or 12 episodes I have done, the budget exceeded the narrators scripting by double......they usually say "the budget was adjusted to accommodate the Homeowner's tastes" of something lame like this!

Believe me, it makes it hard to go to a client's home who saw the show and wants a $250K yard for $50K.....bait-N-switch is more like it.

To clarify, we do not write the script, know the budget or care about the dollar amount represented in the final voice-over of the show......the relevant points are that the Owner gets an amazing yard they can afford, we get publicity and HGTV gets a good episode out of it.

Just FYI, my appearances on HGTV led to hosting my own Discovery show "Backyard Brigade" which made it 2 seasons (1 in rerun) and a pilot called "Bad Boy BBQ" .....it was a blast.

Best to all...rock on!

BD

[papercutter]

Damn, I love the internet. My first reaction when I got the email notification was "no effing way!"

So there's seriously no discussion of budget whatsoever before you start the design process? That's insane! I guess you may or may not know the answer, but are the homeowners at least somewhat prequalified by the producers beforehand- as in, the may think they'll spend $30K but they're liquid enough and potentially willing to to bump that significantly higher to get what they want?

Nice presentation graphics, by the way. They're part of the reason I remembered your name.