[papercutter]

Originally Posted by yeahground

That being said I hope I didnt turn you off from blurting out these red flags... I am here... asking for help and advice .. if you have none .. dont post.. if you do and you dont want to tell me and you post that you dont want to ell me.... how is that getting Homeowner Help?

You see your project as two small, easy walls- a 3' and a 4' wall. Because of the design, the laws of physics see it as a 7' tall wall, most likely with an inadequate footer and geogrid. Because of the forces acting on the wall(s), around here you would be required to get that wall permitted AND engineered. You should check with your local building office to see what the regs are where you live.

Homeowner Help doesn't mean handing you a gun, loading bullets in it, and helping you point it at your foot. In cases like this, it's saying "um, dude? You're pointing a gun at your foot. Don't do that."

[AZTLANLC]

Even if we explain to you all things we see wrong in your design and explain how it has to be done all that could still be wrong, hire an engineer and have him design the wall for you then you might be able to tackle this job.
But I'm sure that after you do that and see all the requirements and type of pieces of equipment you'll need to rent to complete this wall the right way you'll end up saving nothing.
Ask for more hours at your job or get a part time job to be able to pay a professional for this project in the end you'll be more than happy that you did it that way.
Just picture this in your mind you finish your wall and it looks good then one day your child is playing near by and it collapses is it worth it, that is the reason any wall over 4' by law has to be engineered

[Stonehenge]

And walls do collapse. And yes, they have killed people. And yes, they've been walls that size.

My suggestion would be to put aside whatever frustration you might be feeling with this and consider that pretty much unanimously this community is advising against your building this wall yourself. Either we're all idiots for giving that advice, or you are for not taking it.

Either way, my hands are clean.

[kinnanscaping]

Being the consummate conspiracy theorist that I am, I think this guy/gal is not a DIYer but a wannabe contractor looking for some real contractor advice on how to approach this. S/he has the inside track on this job but doesn't know how to do it right. Already tried the scissor lift thing. Getting mad because we are not walking them through this step-by-step. No mention of actually contacting a professional, which most DIYer's do just to get ideas and quotes. Let this one be.

[Lanelle]

OK, I got in a bit earlier from work this evening than last so I have a few minutes to talk about your project. (Did you notice that it was eleven o'clock last night that I put up that post? After a 12-hour day at work,coming home and fixing dinner for my family, I just didn't have much time left for free advice.)
It is good to see that you have an installation guide.
Did you notice on the first page, left side, that the manufacturer advises getting the wall designed by an engineer? You are putting up a significantly sized wall with significant surcharge issues so that statement does apply to you.
Also, look at Fig. 3-16. The toe of the wall is a full block deeper than in your drawing.
Preventing the toe from kicking out is important.
Another element that you probably need is geogrid. There are lots of details and plenty of information about its use.
The notion of building two walls separated by a small planting bed is possibly OK if that bed is twice as deep as the height of the walls it separates. So a two foot wall would have a four foot set back bed and then another two foot wall. However, the surcharge issues on your site may change that---which is why you need an engineer.
If you follow the guide for installing the proper drainage behind the wall, you will increase your walls' stability. Your drawing was less than clear about the placement of drainage and backfill and didn't indicate any geogrid or other gravity method to secure the wall.
The notion that you are going to build a 7' wall the same as a 3' wall pretty much confirms what everyone has said.
If I was going to bring in a crew and build that wall(s), we would first hire an engineer to draw and stamp the design.

[yeahground]

Thank you Lan for your informational post.

We did go down to the city office and show them what we are planning to do.

They said we only need a permit if the wall is going to be over 8' high.

That said, we have now decided to build a single wall instead of two.

I appreciate your comment on

"The notion that you are going to build a 7' wall the same as a 3' wall pretty much confirms what everyone has"

Our total wall hight should only be 6.5' feet high with the caps on top grading down around the corner to 3 feet high.

I apologize for the fact I was not very clear in my ' design ', seeing how I was using Microsoft paint and I dont have an easy way to display 3d design behind the wall and around it... I will take that criticism as ' next time use 3d landscape program before asking for help in here'

I still stand behind the fact that I was asking for help in a homeowner help section and it appeared that no one wanted to help. Either because you were too worn out or felt like it was a design waiting to go wrong.

Regardless I cant change your opinions if you really feel that way. I was still asking for help. and advice.

I am not going to dwell on this anymore, and frankly after reading some of the other people that have posted on this forum im not surprised by your responses. In my opionion, it is almost as though the homeowner help you speak of is only if your a design engineer and your looking for field advice.

I still appreciate the comments and concerns I've currently recieved even though it was like bleeding a turnip.

I will post more pictures of the project for the sake of being able to show my friends and out of town family the progress.

Feel free to comment.. .or not... and if it kills one of us.. you get to say I told you so.

PS. I wish me or my family had the dough to spend on a professional engineer and a professional landsape builder to come and do it himself. But we dont have that extra 2 to 5k or more that would be required ... just for the design and manpower. Sure if the house falls or it kills someone that will be bad too.... in a perfect world..

[Fine Edge]

Everyone on here was just trying to give you help but without actually seeing the site, it's hard to justify giving even tiny bits of helpful info.

Here's one that we had to fix that was just over 6.5' tall. Homebuilder didn't install any drainage behind his concrete block / brick faced wall. Pool builder didn't care what was behind the wall. When it collapsed ( 3 years old ), it smashed all of his patio furniture and 2 grills. luckily nobody was hurt.

So, all I can say is ....Good luck!

[brooks]

There are some more photos of a failed wall in this thread

Expensive learning experience

This was two shorter walls ~3 feet with a 2-3 foot bed in between.

[yeahground]

The top 3 teiers fall down with only a bit of sledge hammering. And pulling down by hand.

[Stonehenge]

Am I the only one holding my breath?

[Greensmith]

Aww man, I hope for your sake it doesn't rain during your attempt.

[yeahground]

Still Day one: 7-20-09

[yeahground]

Ugh... 6 inches of Concrete footing below them thar blocks.. nothing a sledge and pick axe cant take care of..... wish we had a backhoe.

[Greensmith]

Have a picture of the top of the hill ?

[yeahground]

All cleaned out. I am tired. And sore. So far, only my dad and I have shown up to do the work. So much for teenagers coming to help.




The blocks are here! Yuck ... I dont even want to think about them.