I am putting in a paver patio out of my walk out basement. From the door to the foot of the stairs for the deck which comes off the second story is a 22' long and 12.5' drop area.
Given the strong grade I was thinking run a paver patio out about 12', put in a 6-7" step, and then put in crushed stone to the foot of the steps at grade. This will make it very doable if I choose to try it myself.
The pro I had in the other day suggested another idea: run the paver to the height of the first step of the stairs moving the small "retaining" wall / raised patio to the the step).
I have never seen this before and being a homeowner rather than a pro, I still have trouble thinking in 3-D terms as opposed to my 2D. I was wondering if anyone has this / has seen this / has installed this?
Sorry, was afraid it might not be clear. The picture is the area in question. The X is where the patio would run into the stair. Was just curious if this was common. I would assume the retaining wall for the raised patio would run against the stair, and instead of a step off, it would be a step on.
Most likely, i will fall back to the general "peanut" shape in the picture.
Appreciate the response. Great site, great information. Very impressed with both the technical info, as well as the design interest by the pros.
There is plenty of room for a nice transition area there. Rather than stuffing the patio up against the stairs and making one or the other look like an after thought, you could have a second level of the patio that is just as big or small as you want it for a landing area at the foot of the steps. This adds more interest to your hardscape.
Another approach, the one that I would take, is to leave a nice sized planting bed along the foundation and cut the patio in. Then the retaining would be between the house and patio so that the patio is at the right elevation for the stairs. You could either ramp up to the walkout, or have steps there. It also takes away dead patio space (the areas too close to the house to be usable) and allows you do make a much more appealing patio by dressing it out with plants rather than a foundation wall.
Appreciate the insight. Your first suggestion is most likely what we are going with. Roughly where that white line is will be a 6-7 inch step down roughly opposite of the stairs.. The raised patio will run around and back to the house, encompassing the whole 'square' and 'circle' area.
From stair to the patio ther will be a 5' - 6' span which will either be more paver or crushed stone, just for a different medium, over to the stair and the 'entrance' to under the deck, which will most likely be additional paver (11' x 22') at the same level as the stone.
I am curious to your second idea though. To get to the base of the stair with a contiguous field of paver, i need to come down 6.5" or so from the door. This looks to be a problem as the footer beolw the door is uneven and jagged at that point. Are you suggesting coming out further, digging down, and then working back to the stair?
I'm suggesting that you leave the soil at existing grade coming out from the house about 5-6' in order to give yourself a planting bed along the house. Then cut the patio in so that the surface is sloped 1-2% and landing even with the foot of the stairs. You would then put a retaining wall between the planting bed and the patio with a step a few feet in front of the slider. Seeing that it is only half a foot difference, I would not have the wall, but only a step. The bed could roll down to the patio without a wall. The patio will have a nice tucked in look. I would not necessarily square any of the patio, but continue curving it in front of the foundation planting.
I appreciate your patience with the questions. Again, i think in 2d, so posting this as an interpretation of what you said.
If you can let me know how far off i am, would appreciate it. Its not far off from what we talked about, but we had thought about lowering it 6.5" at door, but this sounds very interesting, and give us a chance to tie in going up the hill on the right side.
One thing: You said
"then put a retaining wall between the planting bed and the patio" and then "only half a foot difference, I would not have the wall, but only a step" seemed not so much contradictory as confusing.
When you say "roll down" I assume you are talking about the beds would grade down to the level of the patio over distance.
Something like that. I would not go under the deck with the pavers.
Sorry about the confusion with the wall. I originally thought that the drop was steeper. When I saw that it was only 6" I realized there was no need for a wall.
By letting the bed "roll" down, I meant keep the grade up until it gets close to the pavers, then curve the grade down quickly. This is somewhat of an unretained raised bed. It tucks the patio in visually which makes a more comfortable feeling space in my opinion.
Ahh, thanks. I can "see" it now. The point of the comfortable feeling space was something I had come on as I was working through your idea.
However,
Quote:
Originally posted by agla I would not go under the deck with the pavers.
This really caught my eye, because that, more than anything, has always been the assumed. Just so you know, the intent to excavate under there so there is at least 8' of clearance. what do you see that makes you wary of going under the deck?
Your original patio sat out in the lawn, so it looked like an after thought. I don't think that you will find the space under the deck as a comfortable place to sit. It may have another practical use for you in which case I have no problem developing it. I do think that the patio will be a nicer space with some planting separating it from the deck if that does not interfere with your use of the space.
The first thing is to make your uses work, then enhance what makes those uses better and mitigate any negatives. Plants are strong tools for doing that. You can screen things you don't want to see, frame views to direct attenton, add shade in a hot spot, direct circulation of people, etc,...
I think you have a good program by connecting the deck to the patio and the patio to the walkout. Each one stands alone and they work great together for larger gatherings. The next step was how to make the circulation better between those which is what you addressed with this thread. Once your comfortable with that it makes sense to enhance the patio rather than just having the patio. Allowing for planting is a better experience than being up against a foundation wall.
Perhaps you want to make it more intimate by having enough room for a tall clump birch or something, so that you don't feel like there is a deck hanging over you. It all depends how you want to use the spaces.
I appreciate all your help. I think you have helped me frame some of the ideas we have been bantering about for the last 6 months, as well as seeing some of the refinements we can make to really close it out.
I do know that when we get it right, we will know it. Once we resolve it all, will come back and post the results, perhaps in stages.
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