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Old 07-31-2010, 04:28 PM
Acorn
 
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HELP! Pavers over concrete polymer issues 1400 sq feet

Help me please--

We hired a professional company to build our 1400 multi level patio. Its beautiful- EXCEPT we're having issues with the sand

First round- they put in the sand and at the very end they used 1 bag that was the wrong color to top off the patio-- DISASTER.... so they had to powerwash the entire 1400 sq feet of sand out..... they built the patio on a concrete slab bc its a new construction house and this ensured it would not sink over time as the house settled.

Second round- used a different sand (couldnt get the first one).... as it dried we noticed some spots were light beige (like we wanted) and other areas were dark and wet- would not dry.....

Third round- sand out again- what a mess. now we dont know what to do. They are recommending quikrete (polymer sand).... but i can see that the joints still have some water or wetness below...even though our patio has been in full sun for 2 days.... They tested a small area and I dont think this is going to work--- the second i put water on the are the polyeric sand becomes soft like play sand--- why? Is it b/c its sitting on the concrete thus not allowing the proper draingae and not getting 100% dry....?

PLEASE i welcome any thoughts?? We used techo-bloc-- its gorgous except for this major PIA issue with what sand should we use now??
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Old 07-31-2010, 06:35 PM
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to me it sounds like some areas of the concrete slab are not pitched and holding water underneath, if thats the case then i believe it will all have to be redone
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Old 07-31-2010, 06:59 PM
Seedling
 
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ditto ncsu
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Old 08-01-2010, 09:38 PM
Acorn
 
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starting over not an option

What about Alliance - (though someone just told me that they are not carrying it anymore b/c beige tends to vary in color too much??)

and

Techniseal HP (thoughts- our largest joints are approx 1inch)....

When you pour water on the polymeric sand do most of them get soft again -- and then have to dry to harden each time??
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Old 08-02-2010, 12:28 AM
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Why are your joints uneven? is it flagstone? if you have 1" joints, sand is not the correct material, you would need polymeric stone dust. If it is brick pavers, the joints should not exceed 1/4". We install ours at 1/8". That is what sand is good for, anything larger than that is too large for sand.
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Old 08-02-2010, 01:00 AM
Acorn
 
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the pattern Techo Bloc Olympia PICS ATTACHED

has a rustic old world look- aged corners create some larger gaps in the corners..... if you look at techo blocs website you can kind of see it
Attached Thumbnails
HELP! Pavers over concrete polymer issues 1400 sq feet-grout.jpg   HELP! Pavers over concrete polymer issues 1400 sq feet-walkway.jpg   HELP! Pavers over concrete polymer issues 1400 sq feet-hot-tub.jpg   HELP! Pavers over concrete polymer issues 1400 sq feet-patio.jpg   HELP! Pavers over concrete polymer issues 1400 sq feet-sand.jpg  

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Old 08-02-2010, 01:04 AM
Acorn
 
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cant use polymeric stone dust

FYI cant use polymeric stone dust- we have our pavers on concrete-- just read on a website this:

NEVER USE POLYMERIC STONE DUST WHEN PAVERS ARE INSTALLED ON A CONCRETE SLAB.
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Old 08-02-2010, 06:36 AM
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sorry but if the concrete is holding water underneath, nothing is going to work(except regular concrete sand)........the problem is the poly sand is getting too wet and leaching the glue particles away leaving that soft feel............once it sets it should set hard.......
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Old 08-02-2010, 09:32 AM
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agree with ncsu. unless it is just the camera, you can see the dip in the concrete very clearly in the third picture. that area will always hold water no matter what unless you do not allow the water through. thats what concrete sand will do.
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Old 08-02-2010, 05:06 PM
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what they should have done was drill holes to allow the water to seep thru. Cover with geo fabric so the sand will not filter out of these holes. put in concrete sand. The pic with the hot tub it looks like 3 of the pavers are the "wet" ones they always hold moisture and never seem to dry.
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Old 08-02-2010, 05:29 PM
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What suzie said. No poly sand over concrete. Says it on the instructions. Personally I don't use that crap any more. Concrete sand will work fine.
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Old 08-02-2010, 05:49 PM
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Techniseal's instructions only warn not to mix poly sand WITH cement or sand, doesnt state you cant still use it as a joint filler for pavers on a slab as long as there is a sand bed separating the 2

The other thing i dont know if you mentioned or not, but did the company put the pavers directly on the concrete or did they still apply 1" of bedding sand?
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Old 08-02-2010, 08:38 PM
Sapling
 
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we use poly sand on every job and we do all of our work over concrete slabs, maybe its because the pavers are laid right on top of the concrete or they are applying to much at the time of installation and the sand never bonds?
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Old 08-02-2010, 09:27 PM
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There is a company out there that makes poly sand just for projects laid on top of concrete. Can't remember the name though.....think it was either in Landscape Contractor or Hardscaper or maybe the ICPI publication. Either way, someone does make a product for the application now. It may be fun trying to find someone to order it though, and even more fun paying the shipping for 20 bags....probably cost as much as the sand.
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Old 08-30-2010, 10:15 PM
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Suzie, you say that they had to powerwash the entire patio because they put in the wrong color, I don't get it. This was the first mistake, anyone who thinks powerwashing poly sand has not been in the business long enough to know DON'T TRY THAT STUPID! Bad choice they made. Within a few months you wouldn't of noticed the differnce anyway, most of this sand loses its color within the first year. Bad, bad decision on their part. To make it worse did you really say they tried to powerwash it a second time, ok hit me with the punch line anytime now!
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