[LerchBros]

What is the acceptable time frame to install 100 sq. ft. of regular pavers, including digging the base, screeding, laying the pavers, sand, tamp, edge? Keeping in mind all material and equipment are on site. I know for a driveway the install of the pavers can be quicker b/c there are fewer cuts, but is there some sort of guesstimate on how long the average 100 s.q.ft. install should take? Also, what decent alternatives to sand are there ? We don't like to use sand in the last 2" of our base b/c of wash outs. any thoughts?

[Paul]

Hi, it's really hard to give you a time for install per 100 Sq ft of pavers, I don't know what equipment you have and what pattern you are using along with where it's located in the front yard or in the back or a commercial job. Install times can run from 4 hrs per 100 sq ft (wide open, excavate, install base, sand and pavers, too as high as 20 hrs for tight rear yard areas with hand digging, hand carrying and lots of cuts. Your best bet is to start building a data base of how long it take YOUR crews to do each type of installs, this can be a simple sheet of paper with times to do each job that it takes to install pavers, from layout, excavation, sub-base compaction, base compaction, screening, edging, paver install, cutting, compacting, and final clean-up.



2" of sand........ you should be using 1" of sand. I would check with ICPI on their paver installation specs and see where you need to change. Check here www.ICPI.org

[Stonehenge]

Welcome to GTX, Lerch Bros!

I grew up working for a landscape co doing this type of install. I was their youngest foreman, which meant I handled all of the low-priority jobs...

For a project like you mention, to hand excavate, prep, lay, cut, edge, sand and cleanup, with NO materials on site ahead of time, should take 2 men 1 day.

Keep in mind, larger walks, patios, driveways will all go much faster. Using an asphaltic base, 3 guys can start and finish a 1,000 sqft driveway in a day. So it's hard to take the formula for one project and transfer it to others...too many variables.

I'll leave the sand question alone for now, other than to say that ICPI has a lot of good information, but they have not cornered the market...

[LerchBros]

Thanks for the replies. We have been installing walks and patios for about 5 years now. Every job has been different, matterials, access, patterns, even sea level. I was just wondering if there was a general rule of thumb for install times. Thanks for the input. Oh, we are typically using the normal equipment, skid steers, ts 400s, Bomag plate tampers, lazer levels and a Toro dingo w/ backhoe to get in those fenced in areas. Thanks again

[Rex Mann]

Welcome to the board.

Looking at my production numbers I can give you a few times. However, there will be a few assumptions.

removing approximately 8" of soil
installing approximately 4 to 6" of base
screeding approximately 1" of sand
excavated by hand
backyard access
the project is a patio

Range # of jobs total average
0-300 sf patio 3.6-8.8 17 6.2 sf per hour
300-750 sf patio 5.1-12.3 7 7.5

with skidloader or Dingo?

0-300 sf patio 7.4-12.3 8 10.1
300-750 6.2-12.2 11 9.1

As you can see from these numbers, the larger the job the more productivity you get. Speaking as a rule-of-thumb. These jobs include square patios and serpentine ones. I break down cuts separately, because I charge separately for them.

Machines can even save you more time. However, turf repairs are not included in my numbers.

I have these numbers on just about every scenario out there. These numbers were generated in a freeze-thaw climate of Northern Ohio.

Peace,

Rex

[Rex Mann]

I made a table out of the information, however it is not showing up the way I typed it. I hope you can understand it.

Peace,

Rex

[jwholden]

I break down cuts separately, because I charge separately for them.

Knowledge is power!

[LerchBros]

Charge for cuts? This is all new to me. Normally, we charge 15.00 a sq .ft. for walks and small patios, obviously it changes under special circumstances. We include lawn restoration in that price too. I think from now on we are going to make that a separate fee. How do you charge for cuts?
Thanks for the replies, this site rocks.

[CountyMaterials]

Funny you all are talking about this. I just recently heard of some contractors charging for cuts. Specifically when they are asked to do a herringbone pattern. The reason given to me was because of more waste. How common is this for you guys?

[Stonehenge]

Yeah, there's more waste, and more cutting, but when you compare that to the higher price of OGC, with fewer cuts and less waste, it's about a wash, so I don't really differentiate.

If it's a tumbled product or something that is quite a bit more expensive, then I sharpen the pencil a bit more.

Also, if it's a really detailed/ornate pattern, requiring lots of extra cutting, I do add an upcharge for that.

[Rex Mann]

No two jobs are the same. We charge a base price for sand and pavers and build the price from there. Because all jobs are different.

Charging for cuts is part of it. We charge different for linear cuts vs. curved cuts. Cutting is the most expensive operation of an install. If the owner has a tight budget, we design the pavers to minimize or eliminate the cuts.

It also sounds like allot of guys here have a set square foot price.

Peace,

Rex

[Paul]

We have no set price for pavers but we do have a range of prices. Excavation, base and sand are pretty standard only a few variable there. Of those, haul off or on site of excavation, amount of base (small loads or semi), edging ( few jobs we do require large amounts of edging) may change the price. Size of the job along with how many different areas to be done. The biggest factor for us is the style of paver or PaverS and the pattern along with color changes all have a more direct effect on the cost of the job. Some jobs use 3 to 5 different pavers along with 3 or 4 different colors. Add in 3 or 4 different patterns and you'll see prices rise rapidly.