[Keith N]

Who builds thier waterfalls out of natural stone not using a biofalls or waterfall box. I saw one the other day that looked like they just built it without a box and it looked like a perfect spring outlet. I couldn't determine how they built it without tearing it apart.

I want to learn how to do this but I'm not sure how to without having a leaky waterfall. I assume you line it with liner and install the piping with a pipe boot. Any pointers would be great.

[Stonehenge]

Which part are you uncertain of? How to get the water flow, or how to filter it?

[Keith N]

Originally posted by Stonehenge
Which part are you uncertain of? How to get the water flow, or how to filter it?

Kind of both for the most part. Every waterfall I have built has been with a biofalls. My biggest concern is piping the waterfall. Do I use a bulkhead in the side of the liner, or do I just run the pipe over the liners edge.

[kinnanscaping]

I am new to owning my landscaping business, so bear with me. But, I have also been around the business off and on for 15 years. As I have started my company, I have started to work with a guy that employed me in high school. WAY back then he was doing pretty elaborate falls, streams and ponds. Just this last season I did the work on an extensive fall/pond he designed. The guy is a professional, but here's the thing...
He is bare-bones. Falls and stream liner? Buy it at the salvage yard from flat roof tear-offs (its all made by Firestone anyway). Pumps, hoses, fittings? Go to an industrial supplies wholesaler. Forget aquascapes. Before this website, I had never heard of "bio-falls," "boxes," and the like. I am sure that somebody out there can give me a million reasons for the benefits of said items from aquascapes and other vendors, but I am not convinced yet. You all may create much larger ponds beneath individual falls, too, I don't know. This is just my two cents.

Anyway, he uses a skimmer box in the catch pond at the bottom. At the falls "source" he just tucks the open end of the hose under the stones he has selected to be the "spring source." Nothing fancy, nothing complicated, double pad the falls, glue and seal the liner, and great results IMO.

I am now going to try to attach a short video of the falls we completed in October. Or can I post video on here?

[John Palasek]

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I understand what you're talking about, but my question is why would you want to go to all that trouble?

In the land before Aquascape, I used to build falls with natural stone and a pipe for a water source and all I can say is "Thank God for Biofalls!"

When building falls with only natural stone, you still need a tub from which the water eminates and that means creating a box out of stone and sealing all the edges. It also means creating an inlet opening for the pipe and sealing that as well. No matter how well you seal all of these edges and openings, they're going to crack over time (especially in winter climates) so they will all leak at some point. Because that's true, you'll have to run a liner throughout the back and bottom of whatever you create to make sure all of that leaking water finds its way to the pond.

Since going through all of that is a job in itself, I couldn't see where I was gaining any significant advantage in building a waterfall in such a manner when a biofalls unit solves a multitude of problems and the only "issue" with it is to disguise it.

Not only that, but siting the weir is infinitely easier with a biofalls unit because once my stream bed is more or less in place (or my liner if it's just a basic waterfall), I can temporarily hook up the plumbing and mount the plastic shelf on the falls unit and I can "walk" the weir around the area where it will be and try out different positions until I come up with something either I like or the homeowner likes. Then all I have to do is dig in the biofalls unit and glue up the liner. Everything after that is just decoration.

The word I always hope to hear from a client is the word "natural" as in: "Wow, it looks so natural!"

Once I hear that, I know I've done it right.

I agree that "Nothing beats the real thing", but in terms of ease of installation and the fewest potential headaches, I'll take the Biofalls unit any day over trying to create the same effect with stones, caulking, mortar and flexible PVC.

Take a look at the pictures in the links below. Every single one of these falls - both pond falls and swimming pool falls - start with a Biofalls unit as the water source. Now maybe they're not geologically spot-on as would be a real-life rock formation, but they're pretty darned close and they all look natural. And most importantly, the client is happy.

And the cardinal rule in business is:

"If da' client ain't happy, wud'n nobody happy!"










-JP

[Malrex]

The first pond I built, I hadn't done any research--was just a homeowner trying to DIY in my own backyard. I brought in alot of soil for my waterfalls area and compacted the hell out of it. I then dug a hole--basically made a biofalls out of the mound of soil ( a very large mound--not a volcano looking thing). I then built shelves in the soil, installed liner and put in rocks. The hose ran over the liner and I anchored it to the bottom with large rocks...then pea gravel on top. I planted that area with bog plants and it was actually a pretty decent waterfall (for my first time).

The biofalls box is definately easier. I don't think I would ever attempt building a waterfall area out of just rocks and mortar.

[Stonehenge]

If the pond is of large enough scale, you can build your own biofalls out of liner. It takes the form of Malrex's example - you create a sunken box from earth and/or stone, feed the pump hose into the bottom of it, fill it with successively smaller stone sizes as you fill, right up to the weir stone. It's identical to a biofalls but on a larger scale. No special fittings needed, though you could use Aquascapes centipede to exhaust the water into your biofalls box (or buy a piece of corrugated PVC with a cap and cut some slots - save about $400).

[natural12]

Personally I do not like the bio-falls box. Never have used one. I have seen too many ponds where it is obvious there is a box with stone stacked or piled around it.
I have done what others have mentioned and created a bog for a biofilter. I find this to work better because you can plant several aquatic plants in it which makes a nice back drop.
Or I have just hidden the outlet pipe in a creative manner at the top part of the water fall. Just need to be creative. I have found this looks more "natural" than the expensive plastic box.
A couple of times I have drilled a hole thru a rock for the pipe outlet.

Mike

[Raj Venugopal]

Built my own pond/waterfall 5 years ago with four layers of silo-cap (used to cover crops) and a liner reservoir gathering pond at the top of my watefall-stream system. It's rocked in. Maintenance free since then...the discharge hosing drops directly over the top edge of the gathering pond and is covered with rock. No biofalls, no plumbing to speak of. That said, I wouldn't use such a technique for a client because of the danger of product failure. I found the biofalls unit pricey but useful. The Aquascape bulkhead fittings are garbage...they feel like a cheaper, more brittle PVC formulation (hunch).

[Malrex]

Hiding the box can be a challenge, but in a sick way, I sorta enjoy trying to hide it. I work in PA, but just finished a pond for my parents in WA. They have alot of sword ferns there and with a few of those and some rocks it was the easiest time I've had hiding a box. The sword ferns droop over the box...it was pretty, and looked like the stream continued on pass it.

I think it all just depends on people's preference. If you can make it work for you and works for the customer, then it's all good. I do agree Aquascape's products can be on the pricey side, but for me, as my first year in business, it's less stress for me to just get the pond kit and start working instead of looking for different alternatives--that's what winter time is for.

((I did have a hell of a time with 2 screws for the skimmer box...really was frustrating!!!))

[LandArts]

We built maybe 15 waterfalls this year, none have skimmer or biofalls. No callbacks or maintenance headaches. I'm going to try the Savio skimmer on the next one because it's so easy to mount a UV filter in it.

[Keith N]

Originally posted by Malrex

((I did have a hell of a time with 2 screws for the skimmer box...really was frustrating!!!))

Was that on a signature skimmer on the to lower left horizontal screws? I had one that about drove me nuts this spring.

[Malrex]

Sorry Keith..havent checked the forum for awhile..been busy.

The two screws were actually on the bottom in the center of the skimmer box. It was completely ridiculous how much time I spent on just 2 stupid screws. I ended up getting longer screws and managed to get one tight...this allowed me to use the screw I was given for the other hole, then I took out the longer screw and the smaller screw went in. Hope that made sense, its late and Im tired. I think small bits of grit can get into the hole to cause a problem on the threads or a small bit of the liner gets in the hole. Whatever it is, its a pain. So far, no leaks!! Maybe I'll post a picture later on a different thread. It turned out pretty nice.