[Ford]

I have an opportunity to do a curved step, house entrance job right now. This involves, of course, adhering treads with adhesive. I live in a cold climate, November temp's usually in the 40 degree range, for a high, during the day.

My question is:
What has been the best adhesive to use (in your experience) in that kind of temperature?

Thank You
Ford

[tom]

SRW Retaining Wall and Paver Adhesive is great and will definitely work in your temp range.

www.srwproducts.com

[ScenicAcres]

Can you order paver adhesive in bulk online, or from a supplier and have it shipped to you?

[Stonehenge]

Scenic & Ford - Call Wendy Bursch at SRW - 800-752-9326 - I believe they have the capability to ship.

And if you look at their adhesive page: http://www.srwproducts.com/adhesives.htm

You'll know they can be applied in freezing temps.

In an independant GTX adhesive test, they also tested out very well.

[ianc]

We use PL Premium from Buldog - large tubes $8.00 per tube

~ian

[mrusk]

I hate using any type of adhesive on steps. In a few years they always seem to loosing up. I've used thin set on a few step jobs and have had good results thus far.

[Stonehenge]

Rigid adhesion on a flexible system will lead to problems.

[Ford]

Thanks everyone for the replies.
I used the PL product that Ianc spoke of this past summer. I bought a case of it from my paver dealer, but I ran ran out and they are out of stock at this time. I usually am finished with stone work by this time of the year, but want to finish this part of the project now. I can get a similar product in small tubes, but I have 60' of steps to do and those little tubes drive me nuts.

I was reading the label on liquid nails, sub floor and deck adhesive. It states that it can be used on "wet or frozen treated wood. The label also states that it can be used on ceramics and concrete," for various outdoor and interior projects.

Has anyone here every tried this product?
If so, to what end results?

I am 40 miles from my paver, and wall block dealer, If this stuff works well, it would save me some run time, at times.

Thanks again
Ford

[Stonehenge]

Don't use liquid nails. Just plain not strong enough.

Another good adhesive - Sonneborn

[AZTLANLC]

srw works the best, I also suggest against using mortar for the reason stone stated, I have seen the opposite with mortar vs glue

[Lanelle]

I agree that SRW is the best adhesive.

[steve lester]

i use alot of portland and water mix and use polymeric sand for joints, portland is cheap and strong, we are between milwakee and chicago a lot of frezze thaw here, when using sand and glue my experience is the glue fails in two to three years when sand is used mosture in joint freezes. when we use portland and polysand almost no problems.

[PSUscaper]

I've been using PL block adhesive for the last 4-5 years now with very few problems. Only time there is trouble is if the surface is wet or it is cold enough where the block is frozen. If you have slight moisture and freezing temps there tends to be problems.

As for strength, I have had almost no problems with PL since I started and no call backs. I'm not sure how I judge when the surface is too wet or cold to glue. I just now that when the block looks one way or another the glue won't work. More of an experience thing I guess.

Many of the big box stores carry PL brand products. If they don't have the PL block landscape block glue in the green tube, you can also use the red and yellow tube polyurethane glue, that is probably even stronger and seems to work a bit better in damp conditions. The only reason I don't use the poly is it seems to be messier, harder to squeeze out in cold temps, and is a little more money.

[steve lester]

that is why i use portland the original post was for cold climate. if you use glue and sand only and there is any wet conditions the glue will fail somewhere over time. if you keep the wet out of the pavers by poly sand or sealing the better it will work. portland is cheap $7.00 - $10.00 a bag and goes a long long long way.

[PSUscaper]

Glue doesn't fail over time due to moisture. It will fail at the beginning because it is too wet to set up. It is designed to be used outdoors. When I go to old jobs, you break the block before the glue gives. These jobs are outdoors being subject to wet conditions ALL year long. Glue may fail if it is subject to CONSTANT moisture.....like perhaps around a swimming pool, but I've seen it keep its hold there pretty well.

On jobs where I've had glue failure, it is not the glue that failed....it is the BLOCK! The concrete the glue adheres too breaks off before the bond of the glue does. If its not the block itself, it is because of excessive shifting, where settlement was so extreme it pulled apart. If there is enough force, something has to give, whether its portland, glue, or the concrete itself.

Portland works BUT it will fail if there is shifting in the project over time, and being that were talking about projects without footings here, they are going to move. Glue is designed to hold while remaining flexible. Portland is not. That is not a good design element for flexible systems.

Also, I'm not sure why poly sand is being brought into the discussion because it is not designed to be a adhesive. It may have adhesive properties, but I don't know why it is being brought up in this dicussion of adhering tread stones to block. Poly sand doesn not keep moisture out. It keeps some out, but not all. A sealer would be needed for that, and I'm not sure any sealer is going to gurantee a 100% barrier.

I agree portland is cheaper, but really, how much are you saving by using it over glue on a project? Are 10 tubes of glue breaking the bank on a project? Plus, what about the time associated with having portland, mixing portland, applying portland, cleaning up portland, cleaning up the tools, cleaning up the bucket, etc., etc......compared to putting a tube of glue in a caulk gun and squeezing the trigger????? I see a LOT of portland jobs that are done with excess dripping on the front of blocks. Glue is much easier and cleaner.