[Malrex]

Hey guys...

Have moved into our new log home recently...the yard is nothing but big piles of dirt and I'm excited about landscaping it..when I have the time!

We were going to get a colored concrete patio going, but after waiting 1 month for a estimate from a guy who is suppose to be really good, I'm a little peeved and started to look at other options.

I only have a few months of hardscape experience but feel comfortable putting in flagstone patios as part of my business. I like the look of rock and think it will look good with the logs on my home. My flagstone patios are always laid on a bed of tamped gravel and sand, and thought I would try a mortared flagstone approach to try something new.

Been researching a bit, looks like it's best to have a concrete pad first, then start mortaring in the flagstone? I'm located in Pennsylvania, and we can get some cold weather in the winter...is mortared flagstone a bad move? Would pavers be better in the long run? Any special tricks when applying the mortar...from a book I read I need to rough it up a bit so it will stick better.

I also plan to build two 10-12' long walls about 2' high or so that will enclose part of the patio. I plan to make a base of gravel, then stack cinderblock, add chicken wire, then apply mortar and add a rock facing that matches the patio. Am I on the right page here?

Anyways, thought I would ask the pros before I start my adventure. I read a bunch of books about the patios but I know that experience can bring great advice to the table. Any tips or advice for a fellow landscaper?

[agla]

The problem is the winter freeze/thaw cycle. Mortar and/or concrete has no flexibility. When the soil expands and contracts, the mortar snaps. You get around that by putting it on a surface that is not going to move with the freeze/thaw. That means a steal reinforced concrete slab for flat work and a poured concrete footing that goes below the frost line for walls.

This is the reason that modular block walls are so popular - they flex with freeze/thaw without breaking, so you don't need a concrete footing below frost line.

If you want to use stone and don't want to deal with the extra work and expense of the concrete, dry lay the patio and dry stack a complementary stone wall. You will regret the two options you have listed as soon as you get a real winter. They will break up, it is just a matter of when.