[Stonehenge]

I'm watching This Old House and Roger Cook is installing a brick paver walkway...

Before I discuss some of the shortcomings/flaws of the installation he demonstrated, does anyone else want the floor (err...walk)?

[HardDaysKnight]

I went on their website to see if they had a promo but
couldn't find it. Can't wait to hear your analysis of that
episode. I did find this and thought you guys would enjoy
it.http://www.thisoldhouse.com/toh/know...195213,00.html I love the footing numbers!

[Earth Tool]

I would have really liked to have seen that video.
Could those have been typos about the footers? lol

[GLAN]

Originally posted by Earth Tool
I would have really liked to have seen that video.
Could those have been typos about the footers? lol

I was thinking the same thing.........though the reference to 8' was through out the article.......I dunno?

[Bamboo]

That guy is such a cheese ball! I dunno I dont like him much.
The other guys do such nice projects but roger just delivers cheese. ... >>>>?

[Stonehenge]

For those that missed it, I'll just hit a few of the items that I thought put a cloud over hardscapers...

First was the cutting of pavers - any hardscaper worth their salt is going to have some serious cutting tools, including a tub saw and one or more cutoff saws. Instead he pulled out his 7 1/4" worm-drive circular saw...At least it had a diamond blade on it.

They only showed him part of the time he was cutting a single paver, so it must've taken awhile....at the end of the show he tells the host that installing a curved walkway and the cutting a curved walkway adds (BTW they laid a running bond hollandstone walk), added 50-60% in labor to the project? Say wha?

I can't recall a project (except possibly the patio I recently put in at my place) where cutting in took more than a couple hours. But I guess, if you're using a circular saw to cut pavers, you should expect to be there awhile.

Next was safety gear. I applaud him for recommending it, but we all know those paper filter masks do nothing but reroute the dusty air. It still gets into the lungs as if they were wearing no protection.

Those are a couple of the things. And it's quite possible that they mainly do plantings but the staff at This Old House strong-armed him into doing something he doesn't have a lot of experience with. Who knows?

But I think that show, with th reputation the show and the star have, made hardscapers look like less than what I know them to be. But maybe I'm just being grumpy.

[agla]

Worm drive circular saws with diamond blades are commonly used in New England because clay brick has been used forever and they are adequate for clay. I know people that have diamond cutoffs and tub sws who still will use a diamond circular saw on clay bricks and and on any radius cuts (especially bluestone).

Concrete pavers make up a lot smaller segment of the walk and patio market in New England (This Old House is out of Boston, Roger is out of Winchester I believe). Clay bricks (clay pavers or whatever you want to call them) and bluestone dominate especially at the higher end of the market. Concrete pavers are seen as cheesy substitutes for those who can not have the real thing or mass produced. They have a long history in the area as well.

I think it is more a regional thing to be honest with you.

[Stonehenge]

It's possible, because I've never tried a worm drive saw w/ diamond blade. However, that being said, if the cutting portion of this project (which seemed like a very small element to me on this project) added 50-60% to the labor hours, then it can't be all that efficient. Cutting would have possibly taken 1-2 hours for the project televised.

I notice that the masons in my area are extremely slow to adapt to new technologies and techniques - maybe this is a similar situation in that market with brick cutting tools.

[Bill Schwab]

Most of the flagstone layers use a worm saw with diamond blade. The problem it there is no water attachment to kill the dust. Look at the bright side, anyone who saw that show will now think it adds 50% more labor to add curves, so, you should be able to sell your work for more money.

People all over are slow to adapt new methods. Like Speedbase....I saw another company watching our guys putting in wall base. Laughing....The next day they showed up and saw 3 courses of wall installed with backfill and a row of grid on top....They weren't laughing anymore. Finally, after 20 years of brick over concrete, the architects down here are looking at pavers over gravel and in some situations, geo-webbing to hold it together. This took 20 years.

[jwholden]

I didn't see that segment but I have learned to appreciate the different ways contractors do things. I get This Old House magazine and look forward to reading Roger Cooks piece each month. He just wrote one about laying Belgian Block along a drive, and made it sound pretty easy at that.

I get leery when contractors sacrifice quality for speed, but I don't think Rogers customers really care how he cuts the stone (though I wish he would wear a better respirator as well).

I compliment him, and the other contractors on the show, on sharing work methods with people around the country. It takes a big person to allow themself to be critiqued by every person who ever touched a paver in their life.

[Stonehenge]

His clients might care if they knew they were paying $60 or more an hour for 10 hours versus 2. And I realize there can be speed versus quality arguements for many things, but I don't know if it applies here - like a tractor versus oxen and yolks (sp?).

Like I said - it could be the grumpelstilskin in me that made me so critical. I got a bee in my bonnet a couple months ago on something related and am having a hard time shaking it. At the same time, I just saw a local competitor take a week and a half on a 300 sqft patio, using what looked like a 100-year-old electric tub saw for paver cuts. Sure, tools were not his only problem, but it was one of 'em.

I value contractors sharing methods, too. In fact, just today I pulled a 7' Austrian from one location in our yard and transplanted it to another, using information you shared here....4' diameter rootball, about 16-18" deep, and root pruned the whole thing before re-planting. It's getting water as I type. Maybe because I feel the hardscapes are what we do best I'm more critical of that...you should hear what I say about my own work...